Timothy
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TimothyKeymaster
Raymond,
What I can say for sure is that the 10 kings will give their authority (over whatever territory they govern) to the Antichrist. Those 10 kings all arise from the territory of the old Roman Empire according to Daniel. So, IMO, the Antichrist’s Kingdom will be mostly limited to the extent of that ancient empire.
However, as you know economies are linked by trade agreements. So what happens in Antichrist’s Kingdom will have a ripple effect around the world. There is no way that I know of to predict how this will impact particular nations outside of the territories of the 10 kings.
I believe China plays a significant part in Revelation regarding the “kings of the east.” But this does not appear to enter the picture until just before Armageddon.
As far as preparing those we know for what is coming, location is not what is important. What is important is that we have spotless robes. The primary theme in Revelation is about the fact that those with stained robes will NOT be allowed into the marriage supper (Kingdom), nor will those with stained robes be preserved by God during the time of tribulation. The overriding message in Revelation is becoming an “overcomer” over the world, the flesh, and the devil. And those who take these things seriously the warnings will have the promises contained in the seven letters regarding both a place in the Kingdom and preservation during the tribulation. Those who think that physical preparation or location are the important things are in for a very rude awakening, especially if they are disobedient to the commands of God in Scripture. Only the ones included in the statement, “the Bride has made herself ready” will take part in the marriage of the Lamb.
Those who are preparing themselves by becoming “overcomers” and washing their robes will absolutely understand what is happening and they will not take the mark of the beast. Those who are not “overcoming” in their personal lives, who are self-deceived into thinking that they can ignore some of God’s commands in Scripture and still be OK, will also be deceived into taking the mark of the beast. The deception is incremental, when you tolerate a little deception, Satan gives you a little more, then a little more, until you have completely lost your way. Satan will then throw you a life-preserver — the mark of the beast.
July 7, 2022 at 11:56 am in reply to: How does “Times of The Gentiles” stop Gentiles from being Saved #2751TimothyKeymasterThanks, Randy and Anders. Also, I think it is important to recognize that the “Gospel” is qualified as (literally) “the everlasting Gospel” (“the permanent good message” – LGV). Jesus said (in Matt. 24:15-15), “And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come. Therefore when you see the`abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place whoever reads, let him understand”.
“This Gospel of the Kingdom” is the TRUE and COMPLETE Gospel which contains the true HOPE of the coming Kingdom. It is “the Faith” that was introduced first with Abel, Seth, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, etc., all of the saints of Hebrews 11, and also includes us. The “HOPE” of this Gospel is consistent from Genesis to Revelation. It is the seventh Day (7th Millennium) our Sabbath Rest, the Kingdom. This true Faith has been administered by the very same High Priest since creation, who is “Priest of the Most-High God,” “King of Salem” (Jerusalem) “King of Peace,” and “King of Righteousness.” (Heb. 7)
Maybe we ought to consider whether a “Gospel” which is a later fabrication of Rome contains a fictitious hope borrowed from Greek mythology and philosophy can satisfy this criterion. After all, “gospel” means “good news” and necessarily points to the resurrection and inheritance which is linked to the Kingdom, not to heaven. The “hope” contained in “good news” preached by many Christians is allegedly to be realized when the believer DIES not when he is raised bodily at Jesus’ return. The so-called “Gospel” of a heavenly destiny is not really “the good news of the Kingdom.”
TimothyKeymasterRaymond,
You ask some very good questions 🙂
The “Holy Spirit” is “the Spirit/Breath of God” the Father. So while the “Spirit/Breath” is not a Person by itself, it is both an impersonal aspect of God (such as the “hand of God”) yet it is also an extension of His Person. If the “hand of God” or “finger of God” or “arm of the LORD” is said to do something, it is still the Person of God who did that thing by extension. So it is a mistake to view the “Spirit/Breath” as either completely impersonal or completely personal (as a distinct Person).
Keep in mind that God Himself (the Father), as a whole Being, cannot be contained in any single place. He is bigger and more powerful than the entire universe, which is like a snow-globe on His desk by comparison. Solomon said in reference to the Temple, “the heaven of heavens cannot You, how much less this house that I have built” (1 Kings 8:27; 2 Chron. 2:6,18). Scripture states several times that no one has ever seen God (ex. John 1:18), that He is the “invisible God” (Col. 1:15), that He cannot be seen by humans (1 Tim. 6:16). Yet He has personally reached into the creation by His “Spirit/Breath” to accomplish many things, such as the plagues of Egypt.
Jesus stated that the Father was dwelling in Him. This was not that the Father was fully contained in a human body, but rather the Spirit/Breath of the Father dwelling in Jesus performed His works. Note that the “Spirit/Breath” of God dwelling in Jesus was called by Him “the finger of God,” which implies a limited extension of God Himself.
Matt. 12:28 (ESV) But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
Luke 11:20 (ESV) 20 But if it is by the finger of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
As the “Son of Man” (the human Jesus), blasphemy against Him by Israel or its leaders could potentially be forgiven, and it was forgiven to many Jews on the Day of Pentecost (cf. Acts 2:23,37-40). But blasphemy of the Spirit/Breath of God is blasphemy against the invisible power and person behind the miracles, the invisible One who was the very source of Jesus Himself and all of the miracles that God did through Him.
John 5:19,30 (LGV) 19 Then Jesus responded and said to them, “Truly, truly, I tell you, the Son is powerless to perform from himself – not even one thing … 30 I am powerless to perform from Myself – not one thing.
John 14:8-10 (LGV) 8 Philip says to Him, “Master, show us the Father and it satisfies us.” 9 Jesus says to him, “So much time I am with you, and you have not known Me, Philip? The one having seen Me has seen the Father, and how are you saying show us the Father? 10 Do you not
believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me? The sayings that I speak to you, I am not speaking from Myself. Also the Father, the one dwelling in Me, He is performing the deeds.Acts 2:22 (ESV) 22 “Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a man attested to you by God with mighty works and wonders and signs that God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves know —
The context of Matt. 12:31-32 dealt with the real source of Jesus’ power, whether it was demonic or the power of the one true God. Blasphemy against God’s Agent (Jesus) was one thing. But it was a far more serious crime to attribute the power and actions of God the Father to demons.
If you think about this carefully, you should notice that this passage is very problematic for Trinitarians. If the Father, Son, and Spirit are three co-equal and co-eternal Persons as Trinitarians insist, why is the “third Person” elevated above the “second Person” explicitly and even above the “first Person” implicitly? However, when it is understood that the “Spirit/Breath” of the Father in Jesus, the “finger of God” by which He cast out demons, was an invisible extension of the Father Himself, it all makes perfect sense. One can blaspheme God’s Agent, His Messenger, and be forgiven after repentance. But to attribute the invisible power and will, the invisible source of Jesus’ miracles and power over demons, as being itself demonic, was unforgivable. This is because it effectively calls God Himself “Beelzebul” the prince of demons (Satan).
TimothyKeymasterRaymond,
BBI Module VI has a video (and audio) series:
https://4windsfellowships.net/bbi_06.htmlTim
July 5, 2022 at 11:16 am in reply to: How does “Times of The Gentiles” stop Gentiles from being Saved #2716TimothyKeymasterRaymond,
I agree with Randy’s explanation. The phrase in Rom. 11:25 is “until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.” It is a reference to the completion of a predetermined period of time, not to a specific number of people, since individuals are not predetermined to salvation (as in Calvinism), however time periods are predetermined (see Acts 1:7; Heb. 1:1 LGV footnotes). For the idea of the “fullness” (completion) of a predetermined period of time, see Gal. 4:4 & Eph. 1:10.
There is a similar statement in Luke 21:24, “And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled” (NKJV). IMO, Paul had this statement from Jesus in mind when he wrote the statement in Rom. 11. It is only recorded in Luke’s Gospel, and Paul sometimes referred to Luke’s Gospel as “my Gospel,” since Luke was Paul’s assistant and wrote his Gospel while accompanying Paul in his mission to the gentiles.
Also, note that in both of these passages the context is really about Israel and Jerusalem, not the Gentiles. In Luke 21 the subject is the duration of the time set apart for Israel’s second exile from the land (1960 years), which is characterized by the “desolation” of Jerusalem, meaning no priesthood or Temple (cf. Matt. 23:38; Luke 21:5-6), just as in the first exile (Jer. 7:8-12; Jer. 19:8; Jer. 22:1-12; Jer. 26:1-12). In Romans 11 the subject is the length of time of Israel’s imposed “blindness” which coincides with the second exile. In both passages the gentiles are mostly a footnote, which Paul then employed to stress the great opportunity that God was giving to the remaining nations to receive a blessing due to Israel’s judgement, since Paul was the apostle to the Gentiles and that was his focus.
Also, note that the trampling of Jerusalem by the gentiles in Luke 21 is for the duration of Israel’s second exile, and then it ends. This is because of the brief period allotted to Israel’s national repentance, when God renews the “covenant” for one week (7 years). During this time the Temple worship is to be reinstated as described in Rev. 11:1. The 2 witnesses will prophesy for the first 1260 days, then be killed at the time of the Abomination of Desolation. Then according to the parenthetical statement in Rev. 11:2 Jerusalem will be trampled again for the remaining 42 months.
One final point. In Matt. 24:14 Jesus stated that the Gospel of the Kingdom must be proclaimed in all nations, and then the end will come. IMO, this is a set period of time that corresponds to Israel’s second (1960-year) exile. It is a time marker for when the 70th week will commence, and the “blindness” upon Israel will be lifted allowing them time for national repentance as prophesied by Moses in Deut. 30. So in all of these statements of Scripture, no reference is ever made to the total number of individuals who will be, or can be, saved. As Randy alluded, even though Israel is in “blindness” nationally some Jews are still saved during this age. Consequently, just because the benchmark is reached at the beginning of the 70th week regarding the Gospel having been proclaimed to all nations, this does not mean that on an individual basis no one can share the Gospel or that no one can be saved. The opportunity for repentance and salvation is open for all individuals until God gives up on them individually (as described in Rom. 1:18-32), or after having been a believer they apostatize from the Faith (as in Heb. 6:4-8 & 10:24-31), or when someone takes the mark of the beast (Rev. 14:9-10).
IMO, it is important to distinguish between what God says about His overall plan and its timetable vs. what He says about individuals regarding salvation.
TimothyKeymasterYes, IMO these are the ones Zechariah spoke about in the following passage:
Zech. 12:8-11 (NKJ) 8 “In that day the LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; the one who is feeble among them in that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the Angel of the LORD before them.
9 “It shall be in that day that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
10 “And I will pour on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced. Yes, they will mourn for Him as one mourns for his only son, and grieve for Him as one grieves for a firstborn.
11 “In that day there shall be a great mourning in Jerusalem, like the mourning at Hadad Rimmon in the plain of Megiddo.Zechariah 13:1 (NKJ) 1 “In that day a fountain shall be opened for the house of David and for the inhabitants of Jerusalem, for sin and for uncleanness.
2 “It shall be in that day,” says the LORD of hosts, “that I will cut off the names of the idols from the land, and they shall no longer be remembered. I will also cause the prophets and the unclean spirit to depart from the land.Rev. 1:7 (NKJ) 7 Behold, He is coming with clouds, and every eye will see Him, even they who pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. Even so, Amen.
TimothyKeymasterThat is a really good question for which I do not have a definitive answer. However, I do think Ezekiel 14 is relevant by comparing what God said at the time of the Babylonian exile.
Ezek. 14 (NKJV) 12 The word of the LORD came again to me, saying:
13 “Son of man, when a land sins against Me by persistent unfaithfulness, I will stretch out My hand against it; I will cut off its supply of bread, send famine on it, and cut off man and beast from it.
14 “Even if these three men, Noah, Daniel, and Job, were in it, they would deliver only themselves by their righteousness,” says the Lord GOD.
15 “If I cause wild beasts to pass through the land, and they empty it, and make it so desolate that no man may pass through because of the beasts,
16 “even though these three men were in it, as I live,” says the Lord GOD, “they would deliver neither sons nor daughters; only they would be delivered, and the land would be desolate.
17 “Or if I bring a sword on that land, and say,`Sword, go through the land,’ and I cut off man and beast from it,
18 “even though these three men were in it, as I live,” says the Lord GOD, “they would deliver neither sons nor daughters, but only they themselves would be delivered.
19 “Or if I send a pestilence into that land and pour out My fury on it in blood, and cut off from it man and beast,
20 “even though Noah, Daniel, and Job were in it, as I live,” says the Lord GOD, “they would deliver neither son nor daughter; they would deliver only themselves by their righteousness.”
21 For thus says the Lord GOD: “How much more it shall be when I send My four severe judgments on Jerusalem– the sword and famine and wild beasts and pestilence– to cut off man and beast from it?
22 “Yet behold, there shall be left in it a remnant who will be brought out, both sons and daughters; surely they will come out to you, and you will see their ways and their doings. Then you will be comforted concerning the disaster that I have brought upon Jerusalem, all that I have brought upon it.
23 “And they will comfort you, when you see their ways and their doings; and you shall know that I have done nothing without cause that I have done in it,” says the Lord GOD.Notice the “four severe judgements” which appear to be similar to the 4 Horsemen in Rev. 6.
TimothyKeymasterDave,
In 1 Thess. 3:13, the expression is πάντων τῶν ἁγίων αὐτοῦ. It can be translated “all the holy [ones] of him” or “all the holy things of him.” The word ἁγίων (holy) is an adjective used like a noun. When in the genitive case (as here) it is spelled exactly the same whether it is neuter or masculine. Consequently, it can refer to holy (things) or holy (ones – either people or angels). Which of these is meant cannot be determined by the phrase itself, only by the context or comparison to other passages.
The only other passages that bear upon this question, to which Paul was probably alluding, are the following:
Zechariah 14:5 (NASB) And you will flee by the valley of My mountains, for the valley of the mountains will reach to Azel; yes, you will flee just as you fled before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD, my God, will come, and all the holy ones with Him!
Matthew 25:31 (NKJV) “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory.
Mark 8:38 (NKJV) 38 “For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words in this adulterous and sinful generation, of him the Son of Man also will be ashamed when He comes in the glory of His Father with the holy angels.”
Luke 9:26 (NKJV) 26 “For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words, of him the Son of Man will be ashamed when He comes in His own glory, and in His Father’s, and of the holy angels.
Since revelation is progressive, before we decide what Paul meant in 1 Thess. 3:13, we need to know what Zechariah meant in Zech. 14:5. Since there is no basis in any of the Old Testament for the Messiah appearing in glory from heaven with people in tow, yet there is precedent for His appearance in glory from heaven on Mt. Sinai in the company of a multitude of angels (Psalm 68:17; Heb. 2:2), we ought to interpret “all the holy ones” in Zech. 14:5 as all the holy the angels, not people. This interpretation is confirmed by Jesus in Matt. 25:31; Mark 8:38; Luke 9:26. He used the word “all” and the adjective “holy” but added the noun “angels” in Matt. 25:31. In the other two the word “all” is not included, but “holy” and “angels” are included. All of these refer to Christ’s visible coming in glory to establish His Kingdom. With all of this prior revelation known both to Paul and his readers, it is certain that he was referring to the holy angels in 1 Thess. 3:13. This is further confirmed by Paul in the second letter to the Thessalonians.
2 Thess. 1:7-8 (NKJV) “7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, 8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Translators presuppose something that is nowhere taught in the Bible, that dead people are in heaven, either their ghosts or bodily resurrected pretribbers. They then impose their theological presuppositions and bias upon the Scriptures and translate πάντων τῶν ἁγίων αὐτοῦ in 1 Thess. 3:13 as “all His saints” (ESV, KJV, NASB, NKJV). However, the translators of the NIV, NJB, and a few others did not impose their own false presuppositions on this passage and translated it accurately as “all His holy ones” leaving the reader to decide whether it refers to angels or humans. In the LGV I translated it as “all His holy ones” and added a footnote pointing to these other passages.
TimothyKeymasterAnders,
The beasts in Revelation 12,13,17 represent Satan’s kingdom of darkness, including Satan himself and the principalities, powers, the rulers of the darkness of this age, spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly realms” (Phil. 6:12). Daniel gives a brief glimpse of these in Dan. 10:12-14; Dan. 10:20-11:1; Dan. 12:1. In the NT, Paul gave a brief glimpse in 2 Thess. 2:6-8. The “Restrainer” is Michael and his angels (as in Dan. 10:13 & 12:1). Paul calls this kingdom of darkness which is restrained by Michael the “mystery of lawlessness” (2 Thess. 2:7) which was at work in Paul’s day through Nero and other means (such as Gnostic teachers). In Rev. 12, we have a clear picture of the direct conflict between Satan and his angels and Michael and his angels. This particular encounter is also briefly mentioned in Dan. 12:1 and in 2 Thess. 2:6-9.
Daniel, 2 Thess, and Revelation show some of the physical manifestations of this struggle between the kingdom of darkness and Michael’s forces. However, they are not identical to human kingdoms. The principalities and powers of darkness are on a short leash, being restrained. They are permitted limited interference and control of certain human kingdoms and specific rulers, such as the king of Tyre (Ezek. 28). Satan is called “the god of this age” in 2 Cor. 4:4 but that does not mean his kingdom is exactly identifiable with a particular nation or human kingdom, or even human government as many wrongly surmise. Human government is ordained by God, but Satan seeks to corrupt it and divert it from its intended use. Satan uses as pawns those rulers who give themselves over to him (and who God permits) such as Pharaoh.
Ultimately, there are only two opposing kingdoms in the spiritual realm, the Kingdom of God and the kingdom of darkness. There has been one 6000-year war in the heavens, with many individual battles over the millennia. The nations that rise and fall are the pieces and players that come and go.
Daniel and Revelation at times show both the behind-the-scenes demonic struggle that has been ongoing since the fall, AND the human kingdoms which are the players used by both sides. The world kingdoms are not synonymous with the demonic principalities and powers.
God is also working through the angelic realm and by His Spirit in certain kingdoms as well. For example, He used Nebuchadnezzar to punish Israel, but also promised to punish Babylon as well after he was done with them. God raised up Cyrus of Persia to restore Israel to the land and assist in the rebuilding of Jerusalem and the Temple. In Daniel 2,7,8 the dreams/visions concerned specific human kingdoms that would come to power in succession. While the Seleucid kingdom was a part of Alexander’s Greek empire, represented by the leopard with 4 winds (one of the wings), only one of the Seleucid kings, Antiochus Epiphanes, was a chief tool of Satan, and thus the demonically possessed Antiochus Epiphanes is represented by one of the 7 heads. That is this particular “head” which received the deadly wound is both the demonic spirit and its human host – Antiochus. The entire Seleucid kingdom is not one of the seven heads, only Antiochus Epiphanies and the spirit possessing him. Egypt had many Pharaohs. One of them promoted Joseph and God used him to save Israel. But the next Pharoah was a possessed tool of Satan, which God permitted for his own purposes, to overthrow all of the gods of Egypt and send Israel to the Promised Land. We do not list “Egypt” or even any particular dynasty as one of the seven heads, only that one Pharoah and the spirit that possessed him. Likewise, Tyre had a succession of kings, but only one of them was mentioned by Ezekiel as being in Eden (Ezek. 28:13). Germany has had many rulers, but I have only surmised Hitler and his minions as the tool of Satan, not the entire nation of Germany or its government.
Regarding the head which received the deadly wound, notice that it is said to come up out of the sea in Rev. 13 but in Rev. 17:8 it ascends out of the abyss. This because there is both a physical element (Antichrist) as well as the demonic element.
I believe it is a serious mistake to attempt to identify the seven heads in Revelation as merely human nations or kingdoms. Rather, we must distinguish between what is going on in the invisible spiritual realm in manipulating kingdoms and what can be observed in the physical realm in history, current events, and future prophesied events. I hope this helps clarify my thinking on this.
TimothyKeymasterAnders,
Rev. 12 is the first look at the dragon with 7 heads and 10 horns. Notice that there are “seven crowns” (Rev. 12:3). Thus each of the seven “heads” has a crown, representing seven consecutive kings/kingdoms. IMO, these are the seven “kings/kingdoms” also defined in Rev. 17:10, five of which had already fallen in John’s day, one was current (Rome), and the seventh was still future. The point of revealing the “dragon/serpent/devil/Satan” as having 7 heads and 7 crowns (one for each head) was to give a glimpse into the entirety of Satan’s kingdom throughout history, beginning in Eden. This “dragon” was poised to kill the “man-child” when he was born. This took the form of Herod’s killing of the infants, and then the crucifixion of Jesus. However, He was resurrected, and caught up to heaven. (vss. 4-5).
The “beast” in Rev. 12, which also has 7 heads and 10 horns, is the last-days manifestation of Satan’s kingdom. Notice that rather than having 7 crowns as in ch. 12, there are 10 crowns, one for each of the 10 horns. IMO this removes the focus of seven consecutive kings of the totality of Satan’s kingdom and instead focusses on the ten simultaneous kings in the end times that give their allegiance to Antichrist. I assume that all ten crowns are on the head that had previously been wounded unto death but was healed. Its arising from the Mediterranean Sea IMO signifies the old Roman Empire which controlled that sea and its entire coast. Also, in Rev. 13:3, John saw one of the heads as if it “had been wounded” to death (perfect tense) but the deadly wound “was healed” (aorist tense) already when John saw it arising from the sea.
Notice also that in vs. 16 that the false prophet causes an image to be made to (or for) the “beast” which was wounded by the sword yet lives. So this refers only to the one head which was of the former seven but is now the eighth according to Rev. 17:11. So while this end-time manifestation of Satan’s kingdom is connected to the whole history of Satan’s interaction with human kingdoms, the focus of chapter 13 is only on the one head that previously had a deadly wound but was healed, and the 10 kings reigning with him.
TimothyKeymasterSam,
IMO, it is important to note what John did NOT write: “I heard a loud voice FROM the sky.” Rather, he wrote: “I heard a loud voice IN the sky” (ἐν τῷ οὐρανῷ). Compare this to Rev. 10:8; 11:12; 14:13; 18:4; 21:3 where John heard a loud voice FROM the sky (ἐκ τοῦ οὐρανοῦ) which identifies the source’s location. In ch. 4:1, John was taken to heaven in his vision. Throughout the book, you will notice that his location and perspective repeatedly changes between the land and the sky. It is as though John’s perspective (location) is to observe physical manifestations from the earth, and then his perspective changes to the “sky” (heaven) to observe the spiritual realities and struggles in the spiritual realm which manifest in the physical realm. In Rev. 12:1 John described a great sign ἐν τῷ οὐρανῷ “in the sky” and another in v. 3. So it seems that John’s observational perspective in this chapter is not from the surface of the earth but from above the earth.
Interestingly, the great sign of the woman about to give birth to the man-child, clothed with the sun and the moon under her feet, which is Virgo on Rosh Hashanna, cannot be observed from earth on Rosh Hashanna because the sun illuminates the atmosphere making the stars that make up the constellation Virgo impossible to see in relation to the sun’s and moon’s locations. Only if one could rise above the atmosphere where the sky would become dark could this sign actually be observed. Today we can observe it using astronomy programs where you can turn off the illuminated atmosphere with the click of a mouse. In ancient times, it could only be surmised using sky charts and calculations and by observing the opposite constellations at night. So, for the short answer, John’s perspective in this chapter is in the “sky” above the atmosphere. Consequently, when he wrote in v. 12, “Then I heard a voice in the sky” IMO he was giving his own perceived location when he heard the voice not the location where the voice originated from.
TimothyKeymasterAnders,
1. IMO, the “rest of the beasts” in Dan. 7:12 refers to the remnants of the other previous kingdoms in Daniel’s vision, including Babylon (Iraq), Persia (Iran), Greece. These kingdoms covered various (often overlapping) parts of the world beyond the territory of the Roman Empire (4th Beast) at its peak. The remnants of these kingdoms will continue for a short time into Christ’s Kingdom. For example, “Egypt” is mentioned in Zech. 14 as having its rain withheld because of the refusal to send a delegation to Jerusalem for the Feast of Tabernacles. This implies that there will be some resistance to Christ’s Kingdom in the beginning. Micah 5 contains the prophecy of the “seven shepherds and eight princes” who will subdue the nations under Christ when He returns. Likewise, Isa. 34:8; Isa. 61:2; & Isa. 63:4 describe the “year of retribution” against the nations, which is also the Year of Release, the great 120th Jubilee. Only IF these other nations are defeated immediately at Christ’s coming would we expect the text to limit it to a 42-month period. But since this undefined time will apparently extend beyond the 42 months of Antichrist’s reign, and perhaps these nations will not all be brought under subjection to Christ at exactly the same time, the text leaves this period vague.
2. The word “beast” simply means animal. This term was used by Daniel for the various kingdoms in chs. 7-8. Satan is described as a “serpent” and a “dragon” which are “beasts.” In Rev. 12:3, the creature having seven heads and ten horns is called “a great, fiery red dragon” who is later identified in vs. 9 as “the great dragon, the serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan.” IMO, we must take into account what the seven heads mean. They cannot all refer to Antichrist. The “ten horns” are easy because they correspond to the ten horns in Daniel 7:7,20,24 which are on the fourth beast (Rome), and are the ten toes of Nebuchadnezzar’s image. Also, only ONE of the seven heads was wounded unto death and resurrected, not the entire “beast” with 7 heads. IMO, Antiochus is the ONE head on the seven-headed beast that was wounded and returns as Antichrist. He is the “eighth” sequential king who was also “of the [previous] seven” because he reigned previously but then reigns again in the end times. IMO, for this reason the “abomination of desolation” (which Daniel placed both in the past {Antiochus – Dan. 11:31} and in the future {Antichrist – Dan. 9:27; Dan. 12:11}), Jesus placed just before His return. Why? Because the story of Hannukah provides the precise model for what will occur in the end times, and is carried out once again by the same evil, Satan-possessed man. IMO, this is the only way to harmonize the data in Daniel and Revelation.
3. My interpretation of the seven heads is based first on the fact that the seven-headed beast is identified as Satan in Rev. 12. Also, the “seven heads” are portrayed as sequential manifestations of kings/kingdoms according to Rev. 17:10-11. Since these are sequential, they must be Satanic attempts to overthrow God’s plan for humanity using various kingdoms. IMO, each of these attempts involved a puppet (Antichrist) for Satan to use. These kingdoms are portrayed as a single “beast” because of their common connection to Satan’s dominion. I do not identify these as the sequence of kings in Nebuchadnezzar’s image which is the usual interpretation. IMO, it cannot refer to the Persian Empire because Cyrus was called by God “My shepherd, And he shall perform all My pleasure, Saying to Jerusalem, ‘You shall be built,’ And to the temple, ‘Your foundation shall be laid.'” (Isa. 44:28 NKJ). Likewise, Nebuchadnezzar was God’s instrument of judgment against Israel. In the LGV notes I have given my best guess as to the identity of the seven past kingdoms that were used by Satan in his attempts to overthrow God.
1. The Serpent’s tricking Adam out of his dominion (Luke 4:6), then ruling through Cain (Gen. 4:17; 1 Jn. 3:12). This Satanic kingdom has “fallen” with the great flood.
2. Nimrod’s Babel, replacing God with pagan mythologies and false deities/demons (Gen. 10:8-12; 11:1-9). This Satanic kingdom has “fallen” by God’s confounding the languages.
3. Egypt under Pharaoh who attempted to kill all of the Hebrew boys, and thwart God’s covenant (Ex. 1:8-22). This Satanic kingdom has “fallen” by God’s ten plagues and the destruction of the army in the Red Sea.
4. Tyre in Ezekiel’s day, whose “king” sinned formerly in the Garden of Eden (Ezek. 28:12-19). This Satanic kingdom has “fallen” by God’s sending Nebuchadnezzar to overthrow it (Ezek. 26:1-9).
5. The Seleucid Empire of Antiochus IV who forced Israel to abandon God (Dan. 8:9-12; 10:21-39). This Satanic kingdom has “fallen” by God’s fatal plague upon Antiochus.
6. Rome in John’s day, seeking to exterminate Christians, by which John was currently imprisoned.
7. Nazi Germany under Hitler seeking to exterminate the Jews. He was to “continue briefly.”IMO, there has always been a single, invisible, satanic kingdom of darkness. But it has manifested itself at various times through physical means. The seven-headed beast is this satanic kingdom which began in the Garden of Eden when Satan defeated Adam via Eve.
Tim
March 27, 2022 at 7:32 pm in reply to: The place Jesus prepares now (John 14:2-3) as the New Jerusalem (Rev 21) #2496TimothyKeymasterDave,
It is only humans who have never seen God. Angels in heaven certainly see His face, as Jesus indicated in the following verse.
“Take heed that you do not despise one of these little ones, for I say to you that in heaven their angels always see the face of My Father who is in heaven.” (Matt. 18:10 NKJ)
In the resurrection, we will also see God’s face (Rev. 22:4). So Jesus in HIs resurrected state certainly sees HIs Father’s face.
Just how tangible the Throne of God is exactly, I cannot say. All I know is what the Scriptures says. We certainly believe that Jesus’ throne in the Kingdom Temple will be a real and tangible thing. The following verse compares Jesus’ Kingdom throne (the Throne of David) with God’s Throne.
“To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.” (Rev. 3:21 NKJ)
I prefer not to speculate beyond what the Scripture reveals, and I also tend to take such things at face value.
March 24, 2022 at 12:02 pm in reply to: The place Jesus prepares now (John 14:2-3) as the New Jerusalem (Rev 21) #2486TimothyKeymasterPramod,
The “preparation” for the disciples in Christ’s Kingdom was accomplished by His completing their redemption. It included His crucifixion, resurrection, ascension, and presenting His own blood in the Temple in heaven to make atonement (Heb. 9:12; Heb. 13:12). Provision for complete forgiveness was not completed for anyone until Jesus’ blood was actually presented to God in the Temple in heaven (Hebrews 7 – 10). Hebrews portrays Jesus as both the blood sacrifice AND the High Priest who carried the blood into the presence of God in the Holy of Holies (Heb. 9:22-28). This is also why immediately after His resurrection Jesus told Mary “do not touch Me, I have not yet ascended to my Father …” yet a week later He told Thomas to touch Him to see that He was flesh and bone. Jesus ascended and descended after His resurrection to appear to specific people, but ascended for the last time as recorded in Acts 1.
All of this is what Jesus had to do to “prepare a place” for the disciples and all of the redeemed in His Kingdom Temple on earth. Jesus is not building Christian condos in heaven, nor is He working on a city in heaven that will descend to earth. He is seated at the Father’s right hand.
March 22, 2022 at 9:27 pm in reply to: The place Jesus prepares now (John 14:2-3) as the New Jerusalem (Rev 21) #2484TimothyKeymasterPramod,
I have never taught that John 14:2-3 refers to heaven or the Temple in heaven. I have taught that it refers to the Kingdom Temple on earth. Jesus Himself referred to the Temple in Jerusalem as “My Father’s House” in John 2:16, (and in Luke 2:49 in many translations). The “House of the LORD” throughout the Old Testament is always the Temple on earth, whether referring to Solomon’s Temple, the restored Temple under Cyrus, or the Kingdom Temple in Ezekiel 40-48.
There are several OT prophecies, particularly in Isaiah, which describe the restoration of Jerusalem in the Kingdom, including the rebuilding of her walls by humans, and the wealth of the nations being brought to beautify her (Isa. 60 is one such passage).
In my opinion, what is described in Rev. 21-22 regarding the New Jerusalem is allegory, including its descent from heaven which indicates that God causes her restoration not man.
There is another possibility, however, which was held by some of the early Fathers, such as Irenaeus. His view was that Jerusalem will be restored as per Isaiah, Ezekial, Zechariah, etc., when Christ returns, but will be completely changed or replaced after the millennium by a city which descends from heaven for the eternal state. IMO, however, the parallel language between Rev. 21-22 & the prophets’ description of restored Jerusalem argues against Irenaeus’ view (which is also the view held by many premillennialists).
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